Magni Visited Me Today

[bones]

A few shots of the Magni of Michael and Linda's ????, vistied me today and it is a nice machine but be frigged if i can see the 100k in it, so i wont be rushing out to buy one until they are on half price special shelf :chew:

[bones]

Next couple

[bones]

More

[bones]

Last couple

[Drifter]

Bones, did you get to have a good look at the rotor head? I've seen a few photo's of the head but it'd be nice to grab some measurements.

[russ]

And what about the alledged sonic speed... :chuckel:

BTW........the other week when i was puttin around in a robo 22, the blades were spining at around 500 revs. Thought they would be similar to our gyros....300 ish, concidering they are reasonably similar in weight to a bigish 2 seater gyro.

[Echo 2]

For 130k you could have one of these , a new Nissan Patrol ( or Landcruiser I aint fussy ) ,a good fishing boat , A KTM 640 & enough left over to fill the back of your new ute with beer ...& maybe a set of them wiper blades.. :pelvic_thrust2: :drunk:

[Aussie_Paul]

Magni Head.

Aussie Paul. :wave:

[Drifter]

The reason I'm asking about the Magni Rotor heads is that I hear they are so well balanced. Can anyone tell me if they know of one tha thas failed and if so, why did it fail?

[Drifter]

Aussie, Whats the significance of the red dot of the plate?

[Aussie_Paul]

Aussie, Whats the significance of the red dot of the plate?


I have no idea. :no:

Aussie Paul. :wave:

[russ]

Bones.........interesting...thanks

[richo]

Re: Mew Magni price - Bones, why don't you get your facts right before posting this rubbish?
The price of the Magni M22 has just gone up to 52,400 Euros - about $87,000 + Gst if applicable. Not that absurd price you came up with.

Then you go and bag a bloke's pride and joy after he has been kind and trusting enough to let you fly it. Fair bloody go...

If you want to compare prices with the Magni clones you will find that if you compare them equally, starting with the Rotax 914 rather than the 912 and allow for the meticulous quality there is not a lot of difference. Like many things, you get what you pay for. The art of omission may possibly be overlooked i.e. smaller engine, bushes instead of bearings etc.

Michael is going to adjust the pitch of the propellors to get the correct amount of thrust. He is well aware that he is not getting up to the right rev range.

The controls are purposely designed to feel heavier than most, as a safety precaution for new pilots. Once the trim is set it is a joy to fly, according to everyone else I have corresponded with and spoken to.
No, its not designed for mustering anymore than a road bike is suitable for chasing cattle. It is a very stable aircraft to enable 2 people to cruise in comfort. It is capable of some fairly amazing manoevres (stunts) nevertheless. The true experts won't openly discuss this for fear of encouraging less experience pilots to take risks.

There has never been a structural problem with the frame,mast or welds. I think there are about 490 Magnis in circulation now worldwide. There has only been one fatality to my knowledge which was attributed to the experienced pilot having a heart attack.

Paul, the red dot on the rotor head. There is another on the side of the pillar block to ensure the hub bar is always mounted the same way.

If anyone wants correct information on the Magnis I will do my best to provide it.
Michael.

[bones]

Re: Mew Magni price - Bones, why don't you get your facts right before posting this rubbish?
The price of the Magni M22 has just gone up to 52,400 Euros - about $87,000 + Gst if applicable. Not that absurd price you came up with.

Then you go and bag a bloke's pride and joy after he has been kind and trusting enough to let you fly it. Fair bloody go...

If you want to compare prices with the Magni clones you will find that if you compare them equally, starting with the Rotax 914 rather than the 912 and allow for the meticulous quality there is not a lot of difference. Like many things, you get what you pay for. The art of omission may possibly be overlooked i.e. smaller engine, bushes instead of bearings etc.

Michael is going to adjust the pitch of the propellors to get the correct amount of thrust. He is well aware that he is not getting up to the right rev range.

The controls are purposely designed to feel heavier than most, as a safety precaution for new pilots. Once the trim is set it is a joy to fly, according to everyone else I have corresponded with and spoken to.
No, its not designed for mustering anymore than a road bike is suitable for chasing cattle. It is a very stable aircraft to enable 2 people to cruise in comfort. It is capable of some fairly amazing manoevres (stunts) nevertheless. The true experts won't openly discuss this for fear of encouraging less experience pilots to take risks.

There has never been a structural problem with the frame,mast or welds. I think there are about 490 Magnis in circulation now worldwide. There has only been one fatality to my knowledge which was attributed to the experienced pilot having a heart attack.

Paul, the red dot on the rotor head. There is another on the side of the pillar block to ensure the hub bar is always mounted the same way.

If anyone wants correct information on the Magnis I will do my best to provide it.
Michael.
Michael,
First off i didnt bag the guy's machine,(i also said that i thanked him for the flight in it, which i meant) i just reported my oppions of it, just like i said to his face the other day, i told both he and Linda that it/they were a stable gyro, but no good for what i need one for.

Adjusting the prop wont give it more thrust, as the motor is from memory in the right rev range now, if you pitch it up more he will loose thrust because he will not be able to get the motor to rev out to get the HP, fair go mate it only has a 60" prop on it and it can not possibly get enough thrust to the air to make this machine perform the way it could if it had a 68"-72" prop on it,and that is not possible as there is only about 1" clearance on the keel now, if it were to have that size prop the motor would really be talking turkey then, its a general rule of knumb, that a machine should have a minimum of about 68" for a 2 seater, simply to get the HP of the motor to the air, as i said if the air speed is kept up it is not too bad, but let the air speed drop off and if you were low you would be in trouble..

Adjusting the trim will do jack sh*t to lighten the feel of the controls from side to side, i played with the trim and yes it works fine for the for and aft pressure..

I never said that there was a problem with the design of the frame or the way it is put together, other than if it were to be bent, it WOULD more than likely mean a new frame, which is expensive way of repairing what might be a simple bingle, where as with other designs, it is possible to replace bits and pieces as needed. If i thought it was not safe i WOULDN'T have got in it, it's that simple(to much beer to drink yet :friday: ) but the mast did concern me a little, as in what the future holds for these machines, buti 'm just a dumb gyro pilot what would i know?????

Michael last and not least the price i quoted on the start of this thread came straight of the Magni Website, and at the risk of being in trouble for doing this here it is, the price as far as i can work out is in EURO so after the conversion, plus freight, comes to about what i said, and if it's wrong dont blame me,,,, tell someone who cares




M-16 / M-22 FULLY-BUILT KIT

M-16/22, 914 (115 hp Turbo): $ 77,759 $ 71,397

M-16, 912ULS (100 hp): $ 71,552 $ 65,190

Included Standard:

Electric Start

Flydat or EIS 2000

Altimeter

Air Speed Indicator

Rotor Tach

Fuel Gauge

Cockpit Partial Enclosure

Wheel Brakes

Wheel Pants

Prerotator

Landing Light

Optional:

Electric Trim - Rear stick (M-16 only) $ 187 $ 187

Rear Seat Windscreen $ 1,467 $ 1,467

Rear Seat Pad $ 320 $ 320

Baggage Compartment (M-16 only) $ 467 $ 467

Rear Push-to-Talk Switch (M-16 only) $ 40 $ 40


Common Options

Panel Power Outlet (Cigarette Lighter style) $ 100

Strobe Light $ 427

914 Gearbox Clutch (standard on 912) $ 933

Two Color Paint Finish $ 667

Metallic Paint Finish $ 1,333



A little touchy there Richo, concidering it wasnt even your gyro :poke:

[Aussie_Paul]

Good call Bonsie, 5 mins and you are a Magni expert. :peace: Seriously tho, all you told us in that "pick on a Magni" post is that a Magni is different to what you are used to flying. :cheers: Of course it is. :yes:

I have done a few few hours in Magni's, and different two place machines. The Magni is a true gentlemans gyro. Stable, with all the mod cons to make touring very comfortable. I would not consider a Magni a mustering machine any more than Birdy would his wasa was. But I am sure that it can be flown as hard as the wasa or any of my 2 seat stable cross country gyros.

I appreciated things that are not so noticable, like the workmanship and the use of bearings instead of bushes etc. The rotor head is strong as is the hub bar etc, and the very efficient rotor brake built into the head, as you say Bones, is good.

A Magni is certainly not the gyro for me BUT there is nothing wrong with a Magni. Yes, there are different behaviours, and they fly differently to single seaters as do most two place gyros.

What I did not like about the Magni was the fact that it is tandem and not fully enclosed, as I don't like tandcem and prefer a fully enclosed cabin, BUT that is just me. I know I am bit strange.

I take it you were flying it solo Bones?? It will be interesting to see what you think after a bit more time in it.

Don't worry Michael, soon they will have Firebird to pick on. One of my past students, Ross Bannerman, is on holidays visiting with his overalls and we have had a couple of productive Firebird days. :mrhappy :mrhappy :mrhappy

Aussie Paul. :wave:

[bones]

PB, I never said i was an expert at any thing, thou a few people just asked me to just my opinion of it(privately) so i just threw it up here where everyone could see, i notice that after Birdy put his opinion of the Monarch and the Butterfly, there were some negatives(quiet a few actually) put the importers(agents) took it on the chin and agreed that some of these pionts needed looking at,,,(thou i very much doubt any one will bother listening to me) that was all i was doing nothing more nothing less, but i doubt i'll get to ride in it again after all this bagging get back to Michael, bloody hell i give up, next time if ever i get the chance to do some thing that i dont think a lot of people have, i'll just keep it to myself then huh :fingers:

So since i dont like this crap it's now all gone

[richo]

Hi Paul -
This character goes to the US website, sees prices in US dollars, decides they are Euros and then comes up with that fatuous conclusion. Is it any wonder I'm so F...ing amgry?

There is a saying -

...Better to remain silent and be considered a fool than to open your mouth and prove it.

[bones]

Hi Paul -
This character goes to the US website, sees prices in US dollars, decides they are Euros and then comes up with that fatuous conclusion. Is it any wonder I'm so F...ing amgry?
Well if they are USD why dont it say that on the page, and that is the only place i can find a price of these things......


There is a saying -

...Better to remain silent and be considered a fool than to open your mouth and prove it.

Well you might want to take a leaf of your own book, i since found out that your the agent for these, so that makes you the fool trying to tell me at Bigerden that these would be perfect mustering machines,,, bring it on :censored: :chuckel:

[Brian]

That price of $87,000 plus GST, now I take it that that is Australian $ ???

bones, you were a bit rough mate.

PB, I'm strange too, the 2 seater I want is a side by side type, I cannot see any good reason to spend a lot of money to play bob sled all day every day and be sitting out in the elements, all right for these social flyers ! :poke: :poke:

[richo]

Correct Brian.
When people ask me for prices I send them in Euros with a rough conversion to $oz as it obviously changes on a daily basis.

Bones, I know little about mustering but I gather there are 2 ways to go. Either get down and dirty or stay high and take more of a spotting role in radio contact with troops on bikes and nags. The Magni would obviously not be suitable for the sort of flying you prefer to do. Your machine would probably be less suitable for long distance touring.

Horses for courses.

[Birdy2]

I recon this is spoton. :rockon:
This shows in glareingly obvious detail, wot iv always said bout 'horses for courses'.
Id bet that more n 90% of Bones's flyn has been mustern.
If any mustern bloke was to jump into a machine like a magni he would be thinkn zactly the same.[ "gawd, imagine tryn to wheel critters with this hard mouthed yang yang"] :chainsaw:
But its obvious its not made for mustern, its for cruisn, in fine wether too.
If all you want is to cruise about in fine wether without haven to touch the stick, then a magni is for you, if you can afford it.

Good call Bonsie, 5 mins and you are a Magni expert.
Those in glass houses PB......... :fingers:

The Magni is a true gentlemans gyro.
If thats the case, they wont be selln many in this country. :hahano:

But I am sure that it can be flown as hard as the wasa or any of my 2 seat stable cross country gyros.
Could you elaborate on your idea of 'hard flyn' PB? :confused:

[Brian]

Birdy, are you getting any rain?, been a bit of cloud about your part of the world lately.

$87,000 plus GST gyro is a lot of money for a gyro.If you like flying that much, a Jabiru would be a lot better value in my opinion.

Also, bones has most likely comparing a single seat lightweight to a 2 seat etc etc with the same horses out the back with a smaller prop.They got to run the small prop to keep the thrust line down or else they would have to lift everything up in the air to try and keep the thrust line near CLT.

[Echo 2]

Brian,
saw some pics today of Copi Hollow - crikey , things are grim :'(

Hey Bones , don't appologise for anything you said , you were only expressing your opinion. Imagine all the car makers if they took their critics to heart . Sh1t , there would be no Fords on the road :evil_laugh: .

besides , I thought the same thing when I had a look at a MT-03 :poke:

Echo

[Birdy2]

Buggerall rain ere yet mate, been overcast for over a f^%$# week now, but still no wetty. :bored:
Startn to go [ more] insain :crazyas: watchn these empty poofy clouds float by.

If the magni only has a 60" prop, its easy to see why it cant make full use of the horses, gawd, the wasa has only 62" and its a bigger chord and its not big enuff.

Got plans in me head [ plenty of room for big plans :crazyas:] for maken room for a bigger prop on the wasa. It'll be another first for a RAF mod. :eyebrow:

BTW, its not the power to weight that makes the magni hard mouthed, its the configuration. P/W only makes it climb faster/slower.
But your right, the magni is no comparison to Bonesy's machine wen it comes to performance, or 'throwaboutability' for that matter.
And id have no second thoughts at puttn across Oz in bonsey's machine :chuckel:, itd do it eaiser and with the same leavle of comfort, just with less carrying room.

Anyone who recons Bonses machine cant scoot along, hasnt flown it with the throttle open :evil_laugh:.[ shudder to think wot itd do with WOT and S/L :yikes:.]

Only thing i dont like bout Bones's machine, is that theres only one of um. :evil2:


Imagine all the car makers if they took their critics to heart . Sh1t , there would be no Fords on the road or holdens, toyotas, nissans............... :crazyas: :chainsaw: :blahblah: :censored:

[Brian]

Brian,
saw some pics today of Copi Hollow - crikey , things are grim :'(

Hey Bones , don't appologise for anything you said , you were only expressing your opinion. Imagine all the car makers if they took their critics to heart . Sh1t , there would be no Fords on the road :evil_laugh: .

besides , I thought the same thing when I had a look at a MT-03 :poke:

Echo


Grim all right and I see that Queensland has allocated more licenses on one of the main tributaries so the water situation continues to deteriorate!! :blowme: The Murray will be close to dry by April May apparently, so its going to get grim there too.

We are a bit spoilt here having such excellent gyro builders like Tim, Rosco, Owen etc and our gyros have much more development built into them than probably any gyro in the world. I better include PB in with that lot as the Firebird is pretty close now.

[bones]

But your right, the magni is no comparison to Bonesy's machine wen it comes to performance, or 'throwaboutability' for that matter.
And id have no second thoughts at puttn across Oz in bonsey's machine :chuckel:, itd do it eaiser and with the same leavle of comfort, just with less carrying room.

Anyone who recons Bonses machine cant scoot along, hasnt flown it with the throttle open :evil_laugh:.[ shudder to think wot itd do with WOT and S/L :yikes:.]
And just when did you try it out then ayyy,, but got to agree i got scared the other day and backed off as the gps went past 160 kms into a slight wind,,,, hmmmm gonna have to fit a govener to this thing for the nats i can see that, would like Brian hurtin my baby and all...


Only thing i dont like bout Bones's machine, is that theres only one of um. :evil2:
And unless things get real grim your never gonna get it :chuckel: :fingers: :eyebrow:

[bones]

Ok thanks to all the support from every one here they are back again, it seems that my new older age sensitive side was wrong ,,,,,,,,,, :fingers: so frig them with to mch money invested in these machines, If your feeleind get hurt too bad...


I wouldnt have one of their heads if they gave it to me,,,, its that simple,, i like the rotor brake idea all being inside and all, but it is all so weak looking compared to what we are used to looking at, and the all welded frame, ummm no thanks, if you bend anything you pretty much need a new frame, and all that holds the top setion of mast on is 4 i think 1/4" bolts(the mast is in 2 sections) so all the flexing and ect that goes on is being held together by those 4 bolts,,, mate those Ozz builders are light years ahead in strenght department,,, but if these things have done all the years and hours of testing, they man we got nothing to worry about, thats IMHO.
Dont geet me wrong i thanked him for letting me take it for a lap around the block, but man a bloke would knock up flying that thing for a living like we do, the controls near need 2 hands on them... and the rudder peddles with the nose wheel on the ground, we are talking heavy, no quick turns possible there...

Put it this way if i were to spend 135k, on an A/C, it would want ot go about 130-150kts and have a complete full cab, with air con :giggle:


Well Russ those Magni blades were i THINK 28' and spun at just under 400 rrpm, so i dont think their blades are any thing to rave about, like i did a near stop landing(touch and go) the first time i landed and it took about 150 mts to break ground again and because i pulled it off about 5 mph sooner than it liked, it it just went straight into a right on the curve wobble, and thou the motor was still, screaming(only a 60" prop,, no thrust) it wouldn't pull through it..
IMHO they are designed for people who have beening flying GA and want something else, ie 70 mph take off and landings(yep near on cruise speed before you bring it out of ground effect) cruise i think would be somewhere around 80 mph comfortably, if you got no big airspeed, it just doesnt perform, if it drops below about 60mph, even with full noise ,, it wont recover, need to stick it over,,, though i didnt have a greatr deal of time in it(as it was going to start raining) he is coming back again some time in the future, and i will wring its neck this time :dance:

[Brian]

Thought you might have got a bit of rain there Birdy. There was around an 150 points around and just up the road from here had approx 5 inches, so close, could see the cloud and the thunderstorms.......oh well, tomorrow, we are supposed to get thunderstorms and it looks very promising right up to the weekend.

If the blades are spinning at 400, it means that there is little pitch on them and that they gyro is heavy. Those 28 ft AK's on mine are only doing about 330 on mine I thinks and my old girl is heavy.

Nah, I wont hurt your baby bones, I'm not a full throttle man, and with yours being a lot lighter, it will be a hoot to throw around without worrying about it falling out of the sky.I like to see how easy a gyro will fly, not what it will do with full noise so much and I always like to know there is more throttle left in case it gets tight rather than know you have nothing left except ...going down :yikes: :yikes: :yikes:

[azharfly]

Hi,

I had a fly in the back seat of Michael and Linda's Magni that day they came to Charters Towers. It was nothing but quality like I had never seen before. Beautiful to fly in and looked the same too.
Thanks M&L for giving me that amazing experience.

Azhar

[bones]

Ok Richo,,, can you explain to a dumb ass like ummmm ME, why you can not let the stick go all the way back with out the rotors spinning, on these wunderfully designed machines??????
For those who dont know what im talking about,,,,if you pull full back stick with out the rotors spinning it is a good way of reducing the size of the prop, by that i mean the rotors can hinge back far enough to take approx 1" off the top of each prop blade(60" prop at that,,narrow chord),,,, now that to me is not a good start and i got more if you want keep going :poke:

[russ]

Bones........call it like you see it, if critique bothers some...........tuff

gyros, gyro components.........have ALL been both applauded or "defect outed" since time in memorial.

Like those "Butterfly" gyros...........ugly pieces of shyte. [ 2 built here, 2 bent here ] in my books, that's 100% failure rate.

Even me own build has copped a couple of jibes..........

[Murray Barker]

Russ, be a bit fair with the comments about the butterfly, the first prang (Allans) I witnessed and he did bang the nose wheel down pretty hard,resulting in a rollover. Mitches prang was 100% pilot error,no fault of the design there.

[Mitch]

Keep it up Russell,

You wont even be safe up North Soft Cock. :Bat1:

That thread that got deleted got deleted way to late for you, you tiny little git. :flamed:
Tassy Retard Eh...that would be NSW CockRoach you tiny little insignificant 'man'.
Your a legend in your own mind 'girlfriend'. :moon:

You got a big mouth an Fu*ckall to back it up with. I hear you have 'stuff-all' hrs for 30 years of flyin, all weekend warrior shyte just like most of us. And how many legally trained? Yeah right! And when challenged about any blade strikes or accidents for yourself, whilst you rubbish me and now the Butterfly/Monarch aircraft, you just go quiet. I guess that's cause your a twiny soft cock eh! Guess that's why with all that money and trips away, you just cant find time to come to Lameroo. Aint that right 'girlfriend'. :pelvic_thrust2:

Vortex Generators...you been in the game that long and still dont know the answers to questions that newbies have research in their first five minutes.

You see Russell, just cause CASA are allover you like a rash for being a 'dickhead' with as big mouth, you have to go and get all 'upitty' (term used to describe tiny tots having as dummy spit) and start rubbishing a gyro brand, which includes my aircraft and Allan Wardills aircraft. Interesting dont you think that Allan is back in town and your getting toasted. That post of yours was on the world wide web for 41 hrs before I posted and was removed four hrs after that. Dickhead Russ, irresponsible Dickhead. How long you want to let the world know...45 hrs.....plenty of time for you to mess yourself up twitt. :yes:

As to failed gyro types, I'd be surprised if you dont get your new clt gyro thrown at you in bits.
I heard you were on your way down to Brissy to put a rocket up someones arse....Hee, Hee, Ha! Pee Wee I'd love to a fly on the wall when you try that.

I just love the last line.....Even me own build has copped a couple of jibes..........It's not you build Dick Head, your not building it, you dont have enough 'nouse' in you little finger...it is being built for you, so steady as you go there Russ, dont go over stepping the boundaries again. :pistoles:

Have a great New Year Russell.

Mitch

[Mitch]

Oh Yeah Russell,

Just so you know...a request was made of me to provide info about said 'thread' after CASA representatives contacted ASRA. I did so happily.

I would like to applaude the person/s who did notify CASA. Unfortunately I can not take credit for that Russ, but you can! Twitt. :fingers:

Oh yeah, Have a Great New Year Russell. See you at Lameroo. :joy: :yes:

Mitch

[russ]

Whatever medication or whatever "weed" you are on.........phew. You better get a 2nd opinion.

Mate........you got sum problems :silvia:

[Mitch]

That the best you can do Twitt. :blahblah:
You are the one with the problems little man. :chainsaw:
I'll let the process take care of you.... :paper:
Back at ya girlfriend. :silvia:

[Birdy2]

This threads getn better by the day :peace:

and i got more if you want keep going
Blood oth Bonesy, we need more :poke:, and maybe abit o :punch:

Top post Mitch, best one i'v seen yet :dance:. Stuff the diplomacy ay, just tell it as it is. :pistoles:
BTW, i agree 100 poocent Mitch. :yes:

Sorry Russ, couldnt help meself. :fingers:

[Mitch]

Birdy,
I'm sending you an email.

Mitch.

[russ]

Ok........you win

[Aussie_Paul]

Hey Mitch and Russell. I thought you were both immature. Stop typing otherwise you will prove it. :yes: :yes:

Aussie Paul. :wave:

[niquenaque]

Well...

I'd say if Russ was going 'Mitch' fishing he sure got a hell of a bite.... even if he had 200lb line it wouldn't have been up to the job!

Go boys... nice to watch.

[Birdy2]

Ok........you win
Is that it? :bored:
geez Russ, for someone with a mouth like yours, you throw the towel in pretty quick. :silvia:

Mitch, liz wont be back till the end of the week, so Email will be abit late. ::)

[russ]

Hey Murray........sorry, have to bring you to task... you said......HARD LANDING done it

Read this "report" as shown in the "Gyro News" winter 2005

2nd paragraph.....quote

At the time, pilot error was listed as the most probable cause for the failure, however further investigation revealed that the most probable cause was a faulty weld in the nose gear strut which fractured allowing the lower portion of the nose wheel strut to detach.

The manufacturer was contacted together with the Australian distributor of the kit, and as a result, the manufacturing process used to construct the nose wheel has been altered and improved, and the manufacturer had opted to change the design of the nose wheel in future kits.

The paragraph ends thanking the "Butterfly" Co, for their assistance.

Now, this may have slipped your mind, but ya mate mitch [ australian distributor of the butterfly] he well and truly knew you was wrong, and he does what to correct you.........zip
He was quite happy to see the spin..........it was a pilot induced, hard landing.
You stating the pilot scinario today, took me completely by surprise, as in my memory, i knew somewhere i had heard completely DIFFERENT.........bingo, found it.

Gyro news, vol 18, No 6, Winter 2005

I actually thought that both "Butterfly" rollovers were caused by the nosewheel assy breaking....there you go i was wrong there.

Now finally......mitch, i've sourced ya snitch/s........pity their inputs were in the main flawed, a couple definately "embellished",some "reworked", most, just wrong.Their and my asociation together goes back 5 yrs tops, how they feed you with my background this last 20 plus yrs, is simply amazing. One.....i have met once, the other,3 or 4 times tops. OK, so they are mates of yours, could account for their views, if indeed what you said here, is what they said to you.

As before, your reply will be a litany of profanities, and the like.........pity

[Mitch]

Sorry To dissappoint you Russell. No litany of profanities here.
I have had my fun at your expense.
Truely, I must change my ways. I take no joy in you being a twatt. It's simply a case of ARE YOU A TEAM PLAYER OR A SILLY BOY WHO SHOOTS HIS MOUTH OFF AT THE MEMBERS EXPENSE. It's not a question Russ, I know the answer.

Truely Russ your attempt at dishonouring Muzza and enticing me to bite at these inuendos, is/will be seen for what it is. As you managed to locate, both Butterfly and Monarch accidents were well documented and not part of convoluted threads involving instructors shooting themselves in the foot, threads which are pulled from the web due to some twatt shootin his mouth off, Pee Wee, should I post your comments of admission....dare I say...unlike yourself Sir I do not rubbish other peoples gyros. And still Mister Magic is still holding back on hrs and accident stats, including blade strikes.

You sound a little bit like a Captain of a sinking ship, all full of 'p*ss and wind', till the bell tolls, then desperately trying to lay blame for the catstrophy elsewhere. And for the few you taught to fly, you'd then drag the rest of the crew (ASRA members) to the bottom of the sea. And your telling me...I dont get it! OK Russell Cook explain to me why I or any member should believe you are a team player when you put us at risk by your own admission?

Russell dont be a peanut...Muzza was not wrong, the nose wheel may well have been put down a little hard. The nose gear should never have failed. Turned out to be extremely poor welding job, parent material removed/weld taking up the space and possible nitrogen embrittlement due to the soft chrome plating. This was a single strut. Strut thickness' and styles have been prototyped scince then now we have something even you would think is 'sound'. Larry did not charge for any replacement parts, though Allan was still largely out of pocket on his high ticket items.
Larry did not charge me for my rebuild either. Sadly most of my craft had to be replaced. I kept the wheels and engine. Larry is a tremendous fella, both Larry and Allan are top blokes. And you come on here and throw mud, you nasty old fart. :fingers:

Geez Russ dont jump in so quick next time. You know I'll always respond to you. Unlike yourself, I had to feed and take care of three children, whilst I worked on extending the Bensen blade box, to accomodate the Patroney's.

See there you go Russ both accidents were unrelated to and nose struts failing in both is completely incorrect. Thanks for trying to plant the seed by stating mistruths and apologising for doing so in the same breath. It reecks of limp handed...well you know the rest, the point is it's so blatant, simply shows more of your poor form. The more you expose yourself Russell Cook, the more it suits me, Twitt and I did promise no profanity this time round.
Shifty old "cock" Aye!

As to who might be snitchin for me. Mate I dont work on that level. I tell you to your face. Your snitchin session on the Suspended TA thread was a classic. Mates...who said I had Mates?

I said, "As to failed gyro types, I'd be surprised if you dont get your new clt gyro thrown at you in bits.
I heard you were on your way down to Brissy to put a rocket up someones arse....Hee, Hee, Ha! Pee Wee I'd love to be a fly on the wall."

I dont have any Mates Russell, you have seen to that. Most reading these posts now will think I turned you in. Not so. Didn't have to Russell you gave yourself up. Then you have to try and go nasty of Allan and me. We love our gyros Russell...and I've never knocked any of yours.

Niether have I knocked Bruty's Firebirds or his hybrid, infact I like his hybrid and publicly said so in writting, none of which matters a brass razzoo, frankly I dont like Bruty at all. I know too many cases of Bruty shittin on students and trashin machines to wonder why the 'heck' he even bothered to chime in. Dont start me in on you Bruty...I'm not in the mood and you dont want to go through it all again, not right now your about to start releasing a turn key gyro...Oouuch! That's Harsh, a little to much like Russells take down ploy on Butterfly Monarch struts. Oh I am sorry Bruty. :evil2: Genuine enough for you Mate? Piss Off Paul, dont talk to me about maturity till you sort out your own backyard. :redface:

Back to you Russell, I dont know you Russell. I dont like you. I dont want to meet you ever. Should that happen, no amount of 'happy pill's or 'weed' or any medication I may be taking at said time, will lessen the severity of any spanking I will give you. :moon: :Bat1: Alright pull your dress back down. :silvia:

I was going to post a pic of the new front strut but I did that recently, no doubt a bloke with your skills :crazyas:can find it. :yes:

If you want to call me a liar Russell, say so.........."if indeed what you said here, is what they said to you." Yes indeedy Russell, what am I a friggin psychic? :chuckel::yes: Yeah that must be it. Let me guess...You dont like me either. Huh! Huh! Am I right! :peace:
Hey Russ, I'll let your "Mum" spank you. :lalala: :lalala: :lalala: :lalala: Sorry Russ what's that?...Sorry Russ Mate, can't hear ya.... :Bat1: :Bat1: :Bat1: :moon: :moon: :moon: :lalala: :lalala: :lalala:

I apologise for all previous profanities and any inuendos as to 'Small Dick Syndrome' :pelvic_thrust: as opposed to :pelvic_thrust2:
It was un-Christian and crass. Again I wish you all the very best for the New Year. :fingers:

Been a bucket of fun Russell but I have better things to do now. I hope you can appreciate I am more interested in the longevity of ASRA and the future for the members, than I am in your little excursions into INSANITY, just ask your mate Bruty. I will no longer respond to anything you post, I just wanted you to know I think your an irresponsible twatt. You now fade into black..... :paper::focus: :wave:

Mitch

[Aussie_Paul]

From your above post I am now sure so I rest my case Mitch. :yes: :peace:

Aussie Paul. :wave:

[Mitch]

Yeah! Good Bruty. Wise move.

Mitch

[Murray Barker]

Russ, Allan was practiceing "drop" landings and as I said the nose wheel came down hard,I know the nosewheel strut broke as I was there. Even tho the strut wasnt the best design I have seen it may still be in service today if that arrival had been a bit smoother. I was surprised how well the airframe stood up and it was back in the air in a matter of days with minimal parts replacment.
I made up a new nose fork that will never break and this design will be used in future. A good gyro made better. :yes:

[russ]

Russ, be a bit fair with the comments about the butterfly, the first prang (Allans) I witnessed and he did bang the nose wheel down pretty hard,resulting in a rollover. Mitches prang was 100% pilot error,no fault of the design there.


carefully worded here aye mate........."to be a bit fair" as you put it.." He banged the nose down fairly hard"...........garbage

The selling point PROMOTED by the maker is the ability to "drop" these machines.

Quote from Butterfly Site:


The New G-Force Landing Gear has 18" of stroke and has been tested to absorb up to 700'/minute vertical descent without failure. This patented landing gear has raised the level of safety on gyroplanes forever. No one outside of the Military that we know of can land like we can because of the new G-Force Landing Gear.


Yea.....got dropped.........a rollover transpired, after it bleedin broke apart.
Nice try to smooth it all over without REALLY tellin it as IT WAS..........it bleedin

B R O K E............and YOU knew that, and you knew the outcome of the following investigations.......and you posted the above rubbish :chuckel:

[Murray Barker]

Russ, I know the front strut broke,everyone knows that.I was the only other person there apart from the pilot,I have the crash etched in my brain. The video of this type of gyro doing "drop in" landings shows the main suspension allmost fully retracted before the front wheel hits the ground,with the machine slightly nose up. In Allans inncident the mains were still half extended and the nose wheel hit at an angle,pushing the strut back and snaping it off at the weld. Even if the strut had not broken I think the machine still would have gone over. The accelerated rotor(from the flare) plus the slight pushing forward on the stick may have been enough.

[Birdy2]

You wont win Muzz, you were there, he wasnt, how could you possably know more than him. :chuckel:
Just wait till this airconded tank that can cruise at 80k while only burn'n 16 lph gets go'n, it'll be the new bench mark. :blahblah: :evil_laugh:

[Murray Barker]

Not trying to get a "win",it just shows that the "drop in" type landing in that type of gyro takes a bit of practice. Anyway, Allans got two more gyro crashes yet to make it to my total,and he aint been completly upside down yet.
Russ, hope your son is on the mend.

[Birdy2]

Russ, hope your son is on the mend.
Was wundern where Russ went to. :confused:
I duno wots happened, but i hope nuthn bad. :cheers:

[Mitch]

Word is Russell's son is having ops and it's going to be a tough time for Russell and his family.
Russ I have a son 12yrs old, fully ventilated quad. His name is Taylor and he is my hero.
Hope your young fella has successfull ops. Time for us to chill Russ and take care of yourself and family. :hug: I'll be keen to hear things are turned out right. Good luck to your Boy.
Sincerely, :peace:

Mitch.

[Waddles]

Gents,

What is the maximum size for photos on this thread please? It seems that additional information on my Monarch accident is required.

Waddles.

[Murray Barker]

Al, 128KB for photos.

[Waddles]

Thanks Muz. Standby.(not too long though. I'm not much good at this forum stuff.)

Waddles.

[Waddles]

Gents,

Although Russell is not available at the moment, it is appropriate that I shed some light on the Monarch (not Butterfly) accident in which I was the pilot in command.

At the time, I had less than 2 hours on type and was trying to become used to the GFLG. With hindsight, I think that because it was new and the struts had not "worn in", it resulted in an uneven compression of the individual struts which required attention to stick inputs to remain level after touchdown.

On the day of the accident, I was experimenting with different techniques at getting the struts to compress quicker and more evenly. (I wasn't inclined to try "drop-ins" at this stage.) On the accident flight, I resolved that after a normal smooth touchdown on the mains in the usual nose up attitude, I would lower the nose to a near level attitude in an attempt to unload the rotors and therefore put more weight onto the mains in the hope of compressing the struts more quickly.

All went as planned until I lowered the nose. I recall the nose dropping much lower than planned or expected. Next I recall thinking that I must have tipped over. (Bloody good conclusion). Engine had stopped, no fuel spills, could still move and think ( I think), so released the harness and arose from the dust. The nosewheel was recoverd from the strip about 4 metres from the wreck. The prop tip was also recovered. That's all the debris there was. We righted the wreck and pushed it on its wheels to the hangar. I asked to Murray who had witnessed the event what I had done wrong. He said it all looked normal until the nose dropped.

Inspection of the break in the nose wheel strut revealed crystalisation around the whole weld, and areas where the parent material had been "blown out" during the welding process leaving "dags" of metal on the inside of the tubing.

Subsequently, we have had all the struts re-engineered to prevent a similar occurence. The original manufacturer has also redesigned the strut and changed welders. Repairs were paid for voluntarily by the manufacturer.

Call it what you will, in my book it is research and development. I believe that this was the first or second Monarch sold, and the first to go overseas.

Photos are attached. I can send them in Hi Res to anyone who is interested.

Hope this clarifies any misconceptions about the accident. And yes, it was reported to the ASRA Ops Manager immediately!!!!!

Thanks for the space.

Waddles.

[Waddles]

Guys,

I'm having trouble with the photos. My programme told me it was 127 KB. The post indicates 11 KB. I'll try again soon.

Waddles.

[Waddles]

Trying Again - Waddles

[Waddles]

The broken weld.

Note that I took the photo, so the "housewife" hands are not mine!!!!!

Waddles.

[Brian]

Allan, I wouldn't worry too much about explaining your accident /incident, most of us have done something glorious in our time and it was only Russ who seemed to have a problem and hearing his son needed hospitalization, he was probably just letting off steam on the forum. Sometimes when you are hurting, you can lash out a bit.

[Fencing Wire]

The broken weld.

Note that I took the photo, so the "housewife" hands are not mine!!!!!

Waddles.


A 2 handed grip, eh? Somebody's been spoiled, Al. :lol: :mrhappy

[russ]

Ok........well what do i say, about lost for words, that's for real...

Sometimes in life, things can go pear shaped, and when messages of support arrive from folks you least expect to hear from........bingo.....some of you guys here stand up.

Mitch.....your relayed message to Lucy and me, via Allan, on the eve of the operation.....frankly, blew me away.

To every one of you, that took that time out..............thankyou

PS.......the operation was sucessful, our lad will have to maintain great care of his back, for the duration of life. [ 18 yrs old, and 6'8".......a big lad ] serious complications were allied to his rate of growth.

Cheers...........russ

[Brian]

Ok........well what do i say, about lost for words, that's for real...

Sometimes in life, things can go pear shaped, and when messages of support arrive from folks you least expect to hear from........bingo.....some of you guys here stand up.

Mitch.....your relayed message to Lucy and me, via Allan, on the eve of the operation.....frankly, blew me away.

To every one of you, that took that time out..............thankyou

PS.......the operation was sucessful, our lad will have to maintain great care of his back, for the duration of life. [ 18 yrs old, and 6'8".......a big lad ] serious complications were allied to his rate of growth.

Cheers...........russ


Wonderful to hear that the operation was a success Russ.Great news !!! :clap: :clap:

[rotor]

Good news Russ.

I wish him a speedy recovery.


rotor

[Birdy2]

spoton Russ, thats wot we like to hear. :cheers: [ 6'8", bloodyell, wot you bin feedn the lad?]
Dose this mean we can get back to sinkn the boot into Russ agin? :poke:

Bout wot you say bout the gyro crowd is spoton too. wen it all boils down, and specialy wen someone is down on luck, we're all mates in the end. :yes:

[Mitch]

G'Day Russ,

Very pleased to hear the opp was successfull. Good stuff Mate.

Mitch, :cheers:

[Fencing Wire]

Good news, Russ. All the best. It'll take sum managin. "Backs" are a pain in the arse (only a bit higher) Ya won't have to worry about wot you're gunna do with your spare time. Wot'd he have? Shermans or sumthin.

I'm with you, Birdy. I liked Mitch better when he was gunna kill him. Wot are we gunna do for entertainment at the Nats, now? Might even have to look at gyros.

[russ]

just to bring ewes up to speed.......I ain't lost a scrap......never

Win em all, by at least 100 yards.... :chuckel:

[Fencing Wire]

just to bring ewes up to speed.......I ain't lost a scrap......never

Win em all, by at least 100 yards.... :chuckel:


Crikey Russ! I'm the dead opposite to you. Only had 3 fights in me whole life. One with each wife. Lost em all. :crazyas: :punch: All other altercations in life have been mere skirmishes, by comparison.

Glad to here the lad's on the mend.

[russ]

Thanks mate... :cheers: